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Proposed Downtown Hospital Concept



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First Read: We've asked, and many other people have asked: What's So Wrong With St. Luke's? Review the Changing Downtown Utica Hospital Maps the residents have been subjected too.

It is now called The Wynn Hospital of the Mohawk Valley Health System. But we're reading, Satifying The "Public Use" Requirement Of Eminent (2002) Domain.

MVHS proposes closing our "Old" Hospitals and building Utica's new and only acute care hopital...

1,400 Feet From CSX Mainline!

Wow! Proposed hospital site is 1,400 feet from CSX mainline, well within the federal evacuation zone! Read more at, Downtown Hospital vs. CSX Tracks.

View an illustration of SEQR study's "Reasonably Foreseeable Catastrophic Impact" Of Utica's Downtown MVHS Hospital Concept [Ref.]

On October 5, 2015 our group was passed their Concept Sketch that gave us what's now called "#mvhsdowntown"

January 22, 2019 - From media reports... the Mohawk Valley Health System unveiled the site plan for a new $481 million hospital. Design calls for; nine-story, 670,000 square foot facility, with 373 beds, multiple surface parking lots and an adjacent parking garage located on 25 acres in Downtown Utica. Lots of problems surrounding Utica's #MVHSdowntown, one of which is their VERY false budget. Consider...

Elk Grove, CA: 250 beds, 475,000 sq ft, $750M, $1,579/sq ft and $3M/bed.
Downtown Utica: 373 beds, 670,000 sq ft, $481M, $718 / sq ft and $1.29M/bed.

December 10, 2018 - Officials deny rigging hospital site study, but who accused them?

Their emails make it pretty clear, Steve DiMeo and a few politicians (Brindisi & Picente) rigged hospital siting, no accusing required! Plus, MVHS CEO Scott Perra already confirmed it in April of 2017, "Our Politicians Are The Ones, Mr Tony Picente, Anthony Brindisi and Mayor Palimeir...". This was repeated a few days later by MVHS COO Robert Scholefield, have a listen as Mr. Scholefield states, It Was Made Clear To Us...

October 26, 2018 - The hospital hopes to attract buyin for the corrupt downtown hospital concept. View today's MVHS Press Release & Media Event.

More on MVHS's Renderings reveal, as well as the media coverage...

Via the CNY Business Journal, MVHS Releases Exterior Renderings Of Downtown Hospital Project, also this PDF, See Page 7

Spectrum Local News reports, Utica Hospital Renderings Revealed

UticaOD has story titled, MVHS releases drawings of planned downtown Utica hospital

From WIBX, MVHS Reveals Downtown Hospital Exterior Design

September 27, 2018 - The CNY Business Journal carries news that reads, MVHS unveils look of downtown hospital.

Consider this presentation: Document reviews developments in and around Utica, titled The Mohawk Valley Looking Forward, where pages (49 and 50) reveal what appears to be very early concept sketches of their Downtown Utica Hospital.

Consider this: "Negligible vs. Probability", a study on Derailment Probability Analyses and Modeling of Mainline Freight Trains.

May 15, 2017 - They stated their downtown concept would be "connected to nature" as a design tactic, but then they went back and changed the story. Oh well the link is now gone, yet if connecting to nature was a goal then St. Luke's easily beats Downtown Utica...

June 16, 2018 -What city would bulldoze their downtown; historic and mixed-use buildings, taxpaying businesses (40+ of them!), in exchange for a huge, out-of-scale, tax-exempt suburban hospital district?

Adding insult to injury, Oneida County taxpayers would have to pay for hospital's parking garage. Or should we say, "Garages"? We know the stage has been set and two parking garages were always in the plans. We also know they'd like to say, "Goodbye To Our Utica Police Station" and City Courts to make way for more AUD and Hotel Utica Parking! Oddly and backwards, why is Utica looking to build, when other cities (Rome, NY: $2.5 million for demolition of the Liberty-George parking garage ) are tear down parking garages?

March 22, 2018 - MVHS request to build hospital is taken-up by the STATE OF NEW YORK PUBLIC HEALTH AND HEALTH PLANNING COUNCIL, page 6 to 15 (PDF): Project #172305-C, Faxton-St Luke’s Healthcare St Lukes Division. In this document one can read the considerable Contingencies & Conditions

Read New York Codes, Rules and Regulations, CRR-NY 709.2, PART 709. DETERMINATION OF PUBLIC NEED FOR MEDICAL FACILITY CONSTRUCTION, which starts by stating...

(a) The methodology will be utilized in the evaluation of certificate of need applications involving the construction or establishment of new or replacement beds in an acute care hospital and the need for acute care facilities and services... Read Complete Code

November 25, 2017 - First lies told were about the area, just "crushing blight", "functionally obsolete" (see MV500 Investor Prospectus), and only a "few" or "several" businesses to be impacted. They ignored us when we listed 40+ businesses, but the truth was eventually going to come out...

November 17, 2017 - Sad faces all around, as the devastating MVHS/Hammes Company/NBBJ downtown hospital rendering is revealed...

As predicted, Huge super block, and a sea of parking!

April 24, 2017 - What are the calculations we are missing? What are the differences between Corning and Utica? Why are we seeing this...

This while 64-acres are owned at the St-Luke's Campus, just 1.75 miles from the downtown site!

November 17, 2017 - The downtown concept has been revealed! We show how their concept easily fits onto the St. Luke's campus...

Nothing can make this look good, its just a Sea Of Parking, but here are the news links on MVHS's and NBBJ Healthcare's hospital concept unveiling:

WRVO: Downtown Utica hospital site plan unveiled
WIBX 950: MVHS Unveils Site Plan For Downtown Utica Hospital
Rome Sentinel: Officials unveil site plan for downtown Utica hospital
Spectrum News: First Look At Site Of Utica's Futrure Downtown Hospital [Concept]
WKTV: MVHS unveils partial hospital site plans
CNY Homepage: Downtown Hospital Site Plans
Oneida Dispatch: Designing An Integrated Healthcare Campus In Utica
Politico (Subscription required): MVHS Releases Site Plan For New Utica Hospital

April 11, 2017 What of the reduced safety of urban/downtown hospitals vs. that of suburban hospitals...

We have examined this in detail, the research is on our side. Build a new facility at St. Luke's!

Billed as a consolidation, "One Hospital For All", but really #mvhsdowntown is (per the MVHS CON Application), just Utica hospital sprawl, a new hospital adding to the plight of Old Main...

So Old Main, 100 acres will sit vacant another 40 years? Sad, when the #mvhsdowntown Fits On Old Main Without Knocking Down A Single Building, nor upsetting a single business, historic buildings, or an entire neighborhood! What of the St. Luke's and St. Elizabeth's campuses?

October 15, 2017 - To those arguing that the St. Luke's Campus is not in Utica, please use Google Maps...

July 29, 2017 - Why has the true impact area never been shown and explained to Utica-area residents? Learn for yourself, take a look at the "Utica slow roll" by viewing the Changing Map of the Downtown Utica Hospital District.

May 19, 2017 - Why Utica-area politicians never talk about, or seem to care, that their downtown concept is more honestly a billion dollar concept...

July 8, 2017 - Shown below is just one, but there are many more Voice saying, #NoHospitalDowntown

May 20, 2017 -

May 16, 2017 - Taken from a presentation given to the Oneida County Legislature, look at those who created and or backed the ill-conceived downtown hospital concept. Who knew first, when did these others become informed? We have so many questions for these people and companies...

Let the record clearly show, residents and taxpayers of the hospital system's service area were not listed, and were the last to know.

June 12, 2017 - Did Hammes Company think eminent domain was an option? We don't know, but they found a BIG real estate boondoggle / land grab in Utica...

August 13, 2017 -

July 8, 2017 - Who would own the new hospital land and buildings? Seems it could be a private for profit company, seeking to make money for investors. Does this make healthcare more expensive?

August 8, 2017 - The hospital has been called many things, but in the end it would only be an "inner-city hospital district", within a poor city. The folks at MVHS love to call it a health or medical campus, but they're only hoping to make it sound nicer. Regardless of the label, we've had a hard time understanding the Changing Downtown Utica Hospital Concept Maps

Currently Utica's hospitals are certified to have 571 patient beds, but are only staffed for 400 beds. Initial reports of a new hospital designed with 420 Beds, but to save costs (they said due to newer examination, the downtown concept would have only 373 Beds.

In a money saving effort, (or trouble borrowing maybe?), we learned:

"A parking garage — with an estimated cost of $27 million — was taken out of the plan. The garage is essential, but health system officials believe that third-party ownership of the garage makes sense."

"...plans, though, are likely to allow for future flexibility by including a “shell” for a nursing unit with up to 30 more beds, an enclosed space that can be built into a unit if needed in the future."

"And some savings might come from building nonclinical care areas to a different, cheaper code."

So someone else will, "own the garage" (but see below, taxpayers now said to pay for it!)? They'll build an "empty shell", and "build to a cheaper code"! Wow, is this really a healthcare transformation?

July 26, 2017 -

July 17, 2017 -

July 5, 2017 -

June 18, 2017 -

June 13, 2017 -

May 14, 2017 - CEO Perra says there are missing figures, like a $70-75M new IT System...

June 1, 2017 -

May 25, 2017 -

August 30, 2017 -

June 11, 2017 - Is the architect building a case for his MVHS bulldozers?

They're on a fool's errand, as time will prove...

August 26, 2017 -

April 16, 2017 -

May 26, 2017 -

April 24, 2017 -

September 13, 2017 - We have been told "cost are about the same" (MVHS CEO Perra, April 2, 2016) and "Since $300M is only for downtown, we didn't even study the cost for the St. Luke's campus" (MVHS COO Scholfield, May 2017)

July 4, 2017 -

April 24, 2017 - The "He said, she said" game, for two years, but we now know it was "politicians and lawyers" who placed the hospital into downtown, not the hospital administration: #Emailgate

February 20, 2017 - We wonder how good their numbers are? They've never told us of all the costs, so maybe like this project, Utica will run out of money and new hospital problems would become common UticaOD headlines...

January 14, 2017 -

January 10, 2017 - MVHS offers a handout at two public listening sessions held today. It offered a Q&A that contained...

Q: Has the downtown location only been selected because of its role in supporting urban renewal efforts?

A: “In addition, the language of the New York State bill that would provide $300 million toward the construction of the new health campus very specifically indicates that the “funding will be awarded in the discretion of the commissioner of health in support of projects located in the largest population center in Oneida County…”, which is Utica.”

Read story on public sessions, Recap: MVHS Holds Second Form On Downtown Hospital.

Handout (copy a): MVHS Handout, if not available, see handout (copy b): MVHS Handout

They say "no site yet selected", but that's not what we've been told...

Three campuses consolidating into one, that's doesn't seem to be the case either. Lawsuits ahead because urban renewal is not the answer for Downtown Utica, and a new downtown hospital not the region's healthcare solution.

May 6, 2016 - A Sinking Feeling? Research offers an empirical study of the relationship between real estate prices and distance from the nearest hospital. It shows that hospitals are what the author calls "semi-obnoxious" amenities: you want to be near one, but not too near, because of hospital noise and traffic.

As shown in #DowntownUtica Map, a hospital would impact prices within the blue area. Actually the circle should be larger, since the hospital could occupy a sizeable area, and the critical distance should be measured from the edge of the facility. Plus, nobody knows the size or shape they've imagined- let's hope that the Mohawk Valley Region never finds out!

Spread the word, please Download This Post & Handout To Others (PDF)

Consider Lansing Michigan: In 2004 a Hospital Bed Standard Advisory Committee went to work to develop a plan. Take a look at just one meeting and their 69 pages of minutes (PDF). Did our local Utica hospital board perform such an in-depth audit? We don't have any indication that they did, and yet they have picked their top site in downtown Utica!

Here in Utica citizens are told of a new hospital coming to downtown by way of a newspaper headline. Zero community input, very limited or no communication with property owners in the sited area. Next, citizens questioned the parcel size shown in the paper; it's reported to be a 34 acre site, yet that area is only 12.5 acres! After a newspaper correction, and follow-up story, the site is reported to be 17 acres, but the parcel didn’t change. Two months later Utica has no idea where these 34 acres are.

Read about and see the Changing Downtown Utica Hospital Map, we've updated with another map that shows the Utica Observer-Dispatch had another map, but still not a full disclosure: Changing Downtown Utica Hospital Map, Rev3.


#NoHospitalDowntown is not anti-new hospital, we simply do not want a hospital in Downtown Utica. Here's Why We Oppose The Downtown Utica Hospital Concept and Many Agree!

We're building a Utica Hospital Timeline

No Studies, No Reports, thus we remain #NoHospitalDowntown